Annie, aka the cgig, gives a well reasoned counterpoint to my diatribe about Apple:
[...], why is it considered treasonous in this case for the corporation to go overseas for workers? They were “born” here, partly due to the opportunities that the US provides…education supporting the creators; governmental regulations in their favour; etc. From there, they have expanded to an international company. It would be nice for them to stay in the US then, and continue to foster the economy (and give a bit back), but you mention that they now do business with 100 companies worldwide. Once they have expanded that network, why are they obligated to keep the jobs in the US? Who are they obligated to be patriotic to, if they have shareholders and clients all over the globe?
Not to get all Personhood on you here, but let’s compare this to an individual. Think of it as a person who was born in the US, and moved overseas for work. Possibly because the job market in the US wasn’t that strong. Is that treasonous? In both cases, the person/organisation is doing what is selfishly economically beneficial to them. The person was educated in the US and received all the benefits of growing up with this particular society’s way of fostering growth. Should they feel obligated to stay in the country and give back to it, both through taxes and staying engaged in the community and doing public service? It would be nice if they did, but hardly anybody would consider it selling out their country if the person went overseas.
Well, said. To paraphrase A Street Car Named Desire – I’ve always depended on the kindness of friends to bring me out of my tree. Also I confess I don’t understand the T. Pratchett reference, so you’ll have to explain.
Perhaps we can imagine a spectrum. Let’s construct a selfishness/citizenship spectrum: If there are people on one end of the spectrum that would sell out their country for nothing but money (not even ideology), and fascists on the other end, with an über sense of nationalism, then reasonable, logical folks should be somewhere in the middle. There just is no point in having a corporation with no selfishness at all, otherwise you’re not making money. I ‘get’ that many corporations had a choice of move over seas or close up shop. You can’t even argue about the morality or amorality of Apple if they no longer exist. (Well, I suppose you can, but…)
So now we get to those devilish details. Just where on the spectrum should corporations fall? I feel like they have drifted too far towards the selfish end of the spectrum. Most Americans vote, pay taxes, serve on juries, and generally follow the law. One of the things that warms my patriot heart is the post I had awhile ago about how furriners view America. A whopping number of comments concerned the honesty boxes you see by rural highways selling firewood or potatoes. Foreigners, especially Britishers were amazed. Now, in the great honesty box of life, how well do I think corporations treat honesty? Not very.
Anyway, your point is well taken, so now it is just a matter of what corporations should be doing to be at a good point along the selfishness/citizenship spectrum. Which brings us to your next part:
Let’s see if we can’t find a mutually beneficial arrangement…the best way forward might be to provide the corporations an economically desirable way for them to do what we want. [...] Who in China provides the training? They must be acquiring their qualifications somehow. Presumably it is part of the state-sponsored education system? If so, then perhaps the US should offer that same sort of training. (This is different than sending people back to school to better compete for jobs that currently exist, since that still ends up with the same number of people employed. This is about making companies want to create new jobs in the US.)
I guess all this comes down to a question of approach. Is it going to be “this is the way people are, how do we deal with it?” or “this is the way people are, how do we change them?” (out-of-context credit to T. Pratchett) The changing them gets hard. They will always act for their own self-interest, whether that is the individual or the corporation. But if we can align their self-interest with ours, maybe we can deal with them.
As for “why is it the US that needs to solve the problem”–because it is OUR responsibility to stay relevant in a changing world. Let’s take a good long look at our strengths, and an equal one at our weaknesses, and figure out what niche we can best fill in the future.
If you watched the State of the Union last night, then I think President Obama and you are singing from the same page, which is nothing to be ashamed of. But I disagree with him. If corporations are not pegged at the selfish end of the spectrum, then what kind of ‘citizenship’ things could they be doing? Reagan republicans love to privatize things, and what could be more perfect than corporations setting up their own training centers rather than depending on community colleges? In fact, isn’t this some of the history of our current school system? Forward facing rows, punctual start and end times, homogeneous rote learning all to benefit the industrial revolution (I admit that ‘history’ may be apocryphal, but still…). I would argue that contributing to the training of your own workers is a win-win and also contributes to your contribution as a good citizen.
Again, if we give corporations stable transportation, patent laws, domestic security, tax relief, financial incentives, yadda yadda, what are we getting in return?